Music as Medicine: Emotional Healing & the Art of Being Present | Penn Johnson

What if the song you need most is the one that helps you finally feel what you’ve been carrying?

A familiar melody can bring back a moment you thought you’d forgotten. A lyric can give words to grief you’ve never quite been able to explain. And sometimes, simply listening gives an emotion enough space to rise without asking us to fix it first.

In this episode of Rooted & Wild, Henry Hawk welcomes songwriter, musician, and somatic mentor Penn Johnson for a conversation about music as medicine. Penn has spent more than seventeen years writing original songs. Today, he brings music into his work with people alongside honest conversation, quiet presence, and time in nature.

Penn shares how his own experiences with heartbreak, grief, travel, and ceremony have shaped the songs he writes and the spaces he holds. Together, Henry and Penn explore the intimate relationship between music and emotion: why a song can reach us when ordinary conversation cannot, what it feels like to be met in a difficult moment, and how listening can become an act of presence.

Their conversation also follows Penn outdoors. When we step away from our usual noise and spend time with the natural world, what do we begin to notice about ourselves? And how might we carry that awareness back into everyday life?

In this episode, we explore:

• Why certain songs seem to find us at exactly the right time
• How music can give expression to grief and emotions we struggle to name
• Penn’s approach to songwriting and sharing music with others
• The importance of feeling heard and witnessed
• What silence and time in nature can reveal
• How to practice being present without making it another thing to achieve

This conversation is an invitation to listen a little differently: to the music, to the world around you, and to whatever may be asking for your attention within.

About Penn Johnson

Penn Johnson is a songwriter, musician, and somatic mentor whose work brings together original music, conversation, and nature immersions. Drawing from years of songwriting and his own experiences of change, loss, travel, and ceremony, he creates spaces for people to explore what they feel and reconnect with their own rhythm.

Learn more: 

www.pennjohnson.net

Rooted & Wild provides general information for educational and informational purposes only. The views and opinions expressed by guest speakers are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of Henry Hawk. The content shared on this podcast is not intended to replace individualized medical, psychological, or therapeutic advice, nor should it be used to diagnose or treat any health condition. Listeners are encouraged to consult with qualified healthcare professionals regarding any medical or mental health concerns.

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Rooted and Wild. Some songs are easy to listen to. Others seem to listen back. They find a feeling we've been carrying without quite knowing how to name it. A line lands, a melody opens something, and what we've been holding quietly begins to move. My guest today is Pen Johnson, singer, songwriter, musician, and somatic mentor who brings original music into deeply personal conversations. He spent more than 17 years writing songs and has written hundreds of them. In his work with people, he plays, listens, and makes space for whatever the music brings forward grief, memory, joy, or an honest thought that hasn't yet found words. Penn's path has taken him through ceremony, travel, time in nature, and experiences that shaped the way he holds space for others. Penn, welcome to Rooted and Wild.

SPEAKER_02 1:16

Thanks for having me, Henry.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

So, you know, you decided to basically live a nomadic life and travel the world. And you've been to how many countries at this point?

SPEAKER_02 1:26

Only only a handful, really. Only like uh maybe a dozen countries. But it's expanding for sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

And you spent a great deal of time in each place you've been.

SPEAKER_02 1:40

Yeah, yeah. So uh November, two years ago, uh my longest relationship in my life that I was like, this is my person, just fell apart. Um and I didn't know what was next. And through a series of uh happenings, I was standing in my friend Jerry's yard on the big island, and I had been talking to my friend for a long time about he was like, Kumbomela, Kumbomela, you gotta come to this Kumbomela, it's gonna be amazing. Biggest spiritual event of our lives. And I was like, I was like, he's like, it's the place where the three rivers meet, and the shooting star goes across the sky, and I'm like, I'm flying to India, you know. So like two days later, spoke to flight to Seattle to my ex's parents, uh, because my van was there for a long time. And grabbed some stuff, bought a guitar, got on the plane, didn't really know what was up from there. All I knew is that I was supposed to meet a guy at this airport with my name on a thing, and I got out of the airport, and there's no Wi-Fi and there's no phone, and I'm just like, I guess I'm stranded in India. And from then on, it was just like this trust. It's like, I got you. It's like, what how can you be comfortable with the highest form of discomfort, especially in a place like India? And then you and then we go to the Mahakumbamela, and there's, you know, I'm on a 21-hour train and we're outside the bathrooms on the ground, you know, because we missed the train ticket. And it was just all of these amazing redirections that were like, how patient are you? How open are you? How aware are you? And the entire experience of being in Southeast Asia was like, you know, whether we were hopping, hopping trains and singing songs and gathering crowds or playing at open mics or playing around campfires or playing for people in a village or talking to people. I did an 18-day motorbike trip through Indonesia on my own, on like, you know, uh 1200 kilometers across the this island called Flores, sleeping in villages, meeting people, you know, everything through Google Translate, trying to find coconuts and just like broken English and lost access to my money, uh, didn't have a phone, was stranded for like three days, talked to a group of kids in a in a an elementary school or a grade school who had only seen two white people in their life and just talking about what I was doing and why I was barefoot and why I looked the way I did and how I lived my life. And it was just this beautiful experience that I just want everybody to be able to experience that sort of stuff. I want everyone to know how to feel safe while traveling, while by themselves in nature and being at peace with that loneliness. Everybody has that possibility within them and has gifts that no one else has that they're here to share. And what I want my work to be is an example of allowing people to see that helping people discover those gifts within themselves and approach things from a new angle. So working with people who've created businesses or tech founders or whoever, who wants to create from a place of spaciousness rather than hustle, who wants to envision from the place of being connected to the earth and knowing that we're a part of this, that we're not separate, and using that to connect with people who have the power to make real change in the world because those are the people who need it the most. And those are the people who you know you impact uh a CEO or a founder and change their life. You're changing every single person who works with them for the better because they're gonna show up differently for those people, they're gonna see them as equals, their ego is gonna be dissolved, they're gonna be more connected to nature, they're gonna create more eco-friendly practices, and it just creates this massive ripple effect, and that's what I want my work to do. I don't even need to be online. I mean, I share these videos, which are great, they're super fun, and like I I I laugh so hard at the shit that I make. It is epic. And I don't need to be doing any of that, I don't need validation, I don't need to be seen. I feel so seen by the earth and by God and by the ancestors that I just want everybody else to feel is that to feel that same uh love for life and to know that it's possible, that everything that people are doing, everything that people are struggling with, all of the answers lie on the other side of that uncomfortable fear. It's like, what if I do this? What if I book the flight? What if I ask the girl? What if I take the class? What if I write the song? What if I share the poem? Do it. Because there's only a small percentage of people who are ever gonna do that. And just by showing up, you demonstrate that you're you're ready for what's next. You know, it's like there's this old adage, it's like, it's like, what is it, comb your hair, brush your teeth, and show up, and that's like 99% of it. The other 1% is being open to maybe having your expectations or your uh patience or your uh path, that that side of things, open to having that shift. And I think just openness and spaciousness is the number one thing that people really need right now in a place where everything seems so constricted. And the music helps open that to be a witness to someone's growth, to see someone show up one way and leave another way, with only music and me just being my fucking self, this unhinged, weird, strange, shirtless, barefoot, you know, meat suit, to to know that I don't have to stress over Spotify streams and you know, like booking the night's gig and all that. Like I'm cool with just laying in a forest for like a week. You know, like that's my the highlight of my day is when I put the phone down and I just look up at the sky, or go to an art gallery, or listen to a bird sing for 10-15 minutes, or like watch a bug crawl across a log. Like I love that shit. I go in on that. That is like that's my that's my holy grail. Because so many people never stop to notice those things. And when you show them that that actually exists, we have these perceptory gates that just close and close and close and close as soon as we're born. And as those gates widen and widen and widen, so much possibility opens up for people who never thought they would do or be or say or share or exist in the way that they are. And to witness someone shift in that way and see that from just being with me for a week, I could do that for the rest of my life. I will do that for the rest of my life because it's what makes me feel alive. It's what makes me feel like I'm fulfilling my earth walk, my purpose and soul mission on this earth.

SPEAKER_00 10:14

When you work with people in session to bring healing, help them get clarity, discover themselves, and step into awakening. What does that approach look like as you do ma you know music? Uh how do you help them heal? What is your approach, and how do you use music?

SPEAKER_02 10:34

What are you experiencing right now? How do you feel?

SPEAKER_00 10:38

Well, I feel like I'm calm and talking to a brother.

SPEAKER_02 10:42

What's like what's beneath that though?

SPEAKER_00 10:45

I think exploration, discovery.

SPEAKER_02 10:49

Can I show you how I do it?

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 11:04

You can't look back, oh you can't look back on all the things you never had. You've been living like a lightning flash. No much out you can never look back. You chuchy chugging like an old free train. Cast to the cold call to fear and chain. No destination for got your name. Which link win fummy humming. Just touch down in the foreign land. Brothers in the corner of the busting. Just touch down in the foreign land. Looking both ways as I crossed it. I need an example of one at me. Deep in the waters of the wandering line. So much thing you need. So much thing I'm on the water line. Deep in the waters of the wandering line. You've been living like a lightning flash.

SPEAKER_00 15:12

I'm hearing the words, I'm hearing the storytelling, but it's the moment energetically permeating the space, you know, and a lot of reflection. And so when you work with someone, are you doing numerous songs? Are they involved in that process with you? How does that look?

SPEAKER_02 15:31

Yeah. So the process has evolved, but now where it is and how I really enjoy it is so someone's with me for seven days, all day, you know, sleeping in separate quarters, obviously. Eating food from the land, connecting with local markets, local homesteads, you know, sourcing all of that, seeing how how I do that. The music comes in in the sense of you'll you'll say something in conversation. Like you'll just say something like, I'm like this happened in my life, and I'll be like, oh, that reminds me of this song. And then in these spontaneous moments, maybe we'll have a session that comes out of absolutely nowhere. And one song leads to a whole series of songs. And there's crying, there's deep, you know, and the deeper that we go, it's like I play a song, and then you're like, oh, and that makes me think of this moment, and then we and then another song. And then that's sort of how the sessions progress. It's almost like answers in the form of song, but maybe not answers like, oh, this is what to do, or this is what you need to do, but permission, or things that you've thought for a long time that are finally put to words. And when those things are witnessed, it allows these different pieces of ourselves to unlock or you know, release tension, or release tears, or think of memories or thoughts or things that have happened in your life, ways that you've shown up, ways that you've uh communicated in a new light, in a new like I said, those perceptory gates just widen and widen and widen. So it's and it's a it's almost it's almost like every song is a lullaby, really, and a reminder of humanness, of like these things happen. Permission to feel, permission to grieve, permission to be angry, permission to experience joy and laughter and connection. And sometimes it's it's you know, we're walking through a forest or a jungle and a song will come up and I'll sing a song, and sometimes it'll be a whole session. And the sessions are all recorded so that they can be re-listened to, because that's where the medicine really lies, is in the repetition. People will message me or come home from an experience, and they'll be like, Yeah, I mean, I'm I'm like back in my life and all this stuff, and I just some of the stuff I can't really, and it's like, listen to the songs, listen to the session. The songs are the medicine. The experience is the medicine, but the songs are that's the prescription, you know. Those are those are the answers, those are the keys, and it's all based on what someone says. So these songs are written over the past 17 years, but they feel like they were almost written in the moment for people for their sp for specific moments in their lives. And that's I mean, the songs are for everybody, right? They're not just mine. When I share a song with someone, they say, Oh, is that your song? And I say, No, now it's your song. That's your medicine now. It's, you know, and that came through very clearly in ceremony when people were struggling or on, you know, having psychedelic experiences. The music would keep them on the earth, it would keep them grounded, it would keep them aware of their body and aware of where they were in space. And that's people don't realize that. They go and they drink ayahuasca or they, you know, sit in peyote ceremony, or they, you know, do a mushroom journey with someone, and they don't realize that the space is being held by the music. These are the songs of the plants, the ikero, you know. This is the earth speaking to us. And I think the more that people realize that, the more that they realize that we can't put I'm not healing people. That's not what I do. I help people heal themselves. And anybody who's a healer is just doing that. They've just gotten really good at listening and really good at knowing how to uh shift people's perspective or change a mindset that they have through whatever medium they use, whether that's singles or it's words or it's uh you know, songs, or rattles, or drums, or whatever. And that's that's what's doing that combined with the medicine, is unlocking that within people. And the medicine opens you up to receive that, to be in that open space. It's not it's it's not like taking a pill and letting that do it, letting that control the process. It's taking the medicine to open up to the awareness that it was within you all along.

SPEAKER_00 21:01

Beautiful. So when people come to you for healing, you know, what are the type of things that they're looking for? And how do you what kind of shifts do you see with them over the course of that week and then afterwards, after having done the music uh, you know, healing with you?

SPEAKER_02 21:22

Yeah. So I'm actually with a client right now, and the more that I spend time with her after the experience, you know, a month or so after, she'll even say, Oh, I'm noticing I used to think of things in this way, and now I think of them in this way. Or I remember during this the session when this happened and then it led me to this, or this song shifted this part of myself, or now I'm seeing it from this angle. So to hear and feel people's shift afterwards, especially through the creative outlet, like the The first person who who did this process spent a week. She did everything that I I mean, I I built this whole idea of what this was, and then it became this. And after she did her first immersion, she's actually doing another one in Hawaii in uh about a month. But the first time she did this process, she got, she returned from the immersion. Well, first of all, she quit her job. She retired early, quit her job, uh, stopped wearing makeup for the first time since she was 13, started creating online, not because she wanted to go viral or explode or blow up, just because she wanted to share and express and wanted to give other people that permission. And after our week together, she wrote 160 pages in her journal. She's writing songs, she's writing poems. You know, it's not like these, it's not like they people weren't doing these things before. It just reinvigorates their life force, their mana, their their drive, their passion to to show up for themselves. And those are the biggest shifts that I notice is people recognizing what's been hidden for so long, what's what they haven't been doing. You know, before I was even doing this work, I mean, I've always sort of been doing this work, but before, you know, I would play, I played an open mic in Rhode Island one time. This guy heard me play, he messaged me and said he went, went back and played, well, first of all, picked up his guitar for the first and wrote a song for the first time in 10 years. You know, people say like that I helped them heal chronic pain or whatever. And it's just like noticing how the next time I see someone, how they show up, how they're present, how they process information. The things that they say, the ways that they speak, the cadence, the timbre in their voice, the clear signs of nervous system regulation and like true presence, rather than just performing that because they're in a space with me and feel like they need to show up in a certain way. It's like noticing that that's their new baseline. And I think that's that's a really a main part of it is just their awareness that the things that they share and the way that they see the world is is expanded. Yeah. And yeah, it's like when when you're building something big, you're a founder, you're a uh a leader in some capacity, and you've been holding so much space for all these people, or you know, burning out because you don't feel like you're getting what you're giving people to be rejuvenated and have your cup filled, is it's like you know, people show up depleted and they leave just energized, just super stoked, playful, uh, you know, joyful, connected, spacious, and more willing to take risks, do things outside their comfort zone, uh, have new experiences. And that's all I want for people is to know that they don't have to fit in the box. They don't have to you have permission to change as many times as you want. You know, everybody listening to this has died, has had a death of the ego, right? That's all that that means is the disillusion of who you are. And that happens over and over and over and over again throughout your life. You know, people are, you know, through relationships and work, and it's like you don't have to do one thing, you can restart as many times as you want, but it's really all about permission and showing people it's like, oh, I can do that. It's like you can do that. You can do that. Absolutely. You have the ability and the permission to do whatever you want. So, and that can be that can be um beautiful and it can be it can be terrible, and it's like everything in between. So ultimately it's a choice. And I just want people to realize that they can choose to what if themselves to death, or they can choose to what if themselves back to life.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

Yeah. So good. Penn, uh, I feel like we could spend several hours talking about all kinds of things. And but for the sake of our listeners, um, we're gonna wrap this up right now because but I want to leave this to those listening. Uh, make sure that you check out Pen Johnson's website. That's penjohnson.net. So P-E-N-N Johnson.net, and follow him on Instagram as well. The you can access resources, good content every day, music, and opportunities for retreats and personal one-on-one healing sessions as well as uh, you know, group retreats. So, Penn, it's an absolute pleasure. I'm so glad we finally got to do this after a while. It feels like it was a good timing to do it today.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

Everything's, you know, God doesn't make mistakes. Everything's perfect.

SPEAKER_00 27:44

For sure, for sure. And for all those who are listening, thank you for joining us. Stay rooted and stay wild.